15in1 investigation

[MLX]

Yes, also it do not have coding, it only include some names of some characters that appear in Titenic. Which means the game was probably at the planning time. They used MK4 code to test some stuff and forgot to remove it.

[taizou]

i just noticed the font used to write "Harry Potter" in Harrys Legend is the same as the one used for ABABsoft's URL on their multicart menu .. Hummer/etc never used it before. so maybe Harrys Legend was actually only created (hacked from Titenic) by ABABsoft in 200-something? it never showed up anywhere before 2003 as far as I know.

[MLX]

CaH4e3 dumped a single Harry's Legend cartridge in October 2003. If it was only released on a 4in1 by ABAB Soft. then the time that it was released then extracted from the 4in1 then remade on another cartridge, then it would have took 1 year easily.

For me Harry's Legend was made by Hummer Team, the changes are to important to be a simple hack by another developpers. They wouldn't have noticed some stuff.

[brightentayle]

MLX

Sep 1 2010, 08:04:08 AM

For me Harry's Legend was made by Hummer Team, the changes are to important to be a simple hack by another developpers. They wouldn't have noticed some stuff.[/quote]Moment. Wasn't Hummer Team the part of the ABAB Soft at the moment? All I think about is that ABAB simply rehashed their existing game. Haven't these bastards reused some music from (maybe) their EWJ3?

[KingPepe]

Crash Nicker

Sep 1 2010, 09:01:34 AM

Moment. Wasn't Hummer Team the part of the ABAB Soft at the moment? All I think about is that ABAB simply rehashed their existing game. Haven't these bastards reused some music from (maybe) their EWJ3?[/quote]Not exactly Hummer Team, just a few members.

[codeman38]

taizou

Aug 31 2010, 04:32:22 PM

i just noticed the font used to write "Harry Potter" in Harrys Legend is the same as the one used for ABABsoft's URL on their multicart menu .. Hummer/etc never used it before. so maybe Harrys Legend was actually only created (hacked from Titenic) by ABABsoft in 200-something? it never showed up anywhere before 2003 as far as I know.[/quote]Ah, that's because it's from one of the many versions of EA's DeluxePaint. And it doesn't really prove anything year-wise, since the latest version of DPaint is from 1990.

Edit: Although it might've been that Hummer only used DPaint later in their career, one of Hummer's other fonts very closely resembles the "Comic" font from DPaint, which I converted to TrueType as DPComic.

[Awesome Panda]

One thing I don't get. The credits list Rebecca and Chris. Are those psuedonyms of Hummer Team staff that worked on other games?

[taizou]

codeman38

Sep 1 2010, 09:13:51 AM

Ah, that's because it's from one of the many versions of EA's DeluxePaint. And it doesn't really prove anything year-wise, since the latest version of DPaint is from 1990.

Edit: Although it might've been that Hummer only used DPaint later in their career, one of Hummer's other fonts very closely resembles the "Comic" font from DPaint, which I converted to TrueType as DPComic.[/quote]ah that explains why it seems familiar - I had Deluxe Paint for the Amiga way back in 199X or something. nice catch!

MLX

 

CaH4e3 dumped a single Harry's Legend cartridge in October 2003. If it was only released on a 4in1 by ABAB Soft. then the time that it was released then extracted from the 4in1 then remade on another cartridge, then it would have took 1 year easily.[/quote]
i bought a 64 in 1 with Harry's Legend in about mid-2003 -  it seems like it only became widespread in 03 for some reason, even if it originally was released before then.

MLX

 

For me Harry's Legend was made by Hummer Team, the changes are to important to be a simple hack by another developpers. They wouldn't have noticed some stuff.[/quote]
but if there were still some Hummer Team members with ABAB, they probably still would have had the Titenic source code, even if Hummer Cheng wasn't there anymore. given the source it probably wouldn't be too hard for another programmer to make those changes. plus Hummer Cheng probably wouldn't remove his own name from the game.
 and don't forget they still missed some stuff - that glitchy "co-op" mode is still in there.

[MLX]

The glitchy co-op mode isn't really a co-op mode. More likely to be a debug mode (just by the fact you can change the water level). Also the debug mode on HL has more characters. Which means the programmer (Hummer Cheng !!) knew about it.

And if we think Hummer Cheng isn't Silvers Lin, WHY he would have learned how to code for one game then stop ?
And also that "The Legend" game. Why someone who would have have worked on the music still had the source code of SFIV ? It would make sense if it was a programmer but not someone who done the music. The Legend is mainly a source code update to the game.

Also you didn't answer my message about KoF96.

[codeman38]

taizou

Sep 1 2010, 09:28:31 AM

ah that explains why it seems familiar - I had Deluxe Paint for the Amiga way back in 199X or something. nice catch! [/quote]Heh, yeah. I recognized it myself because I had the DOS version when I was a youngster.

Come to think of it, I ought to do a post on recognizing fonts from old paint programs. Deluxe Paint's fonts are all over the place in bootleg games, about as prevalent (if not more prevalent) than PC Paint's.

[taizou]

codeman38

Sep 1 2010, 12:51:40 PM

Come to think of it, I ought to do a post on recognizing fonts from old paint programs. Deluxe Paint's fonts are all over the place in bootleg games, about as prevalent (if not more prevalent) than PC Paint's.[/quote]yeah, some of Gowin's mono GB games even use both.

MLX

 

The glitchy co-op mode isn't really a co-op mode. More likely to be a debug mode (just by the fact you can change the water level). Also the debug mode on HL has more characters. Which means the programmer (Hummer Cheng !!) knew about it.[/quote]But the extra characters still could have been added by the new programmer, if they knew the debug mode was there. they just forgot to remove it.

MLX

 

And if we think Hummer Cheng isn't Silvers Lin, WHY he would have learned how to code for one game then stop ? [/quote]
But we don't know that. Most of these games don't have credits. We only know Cheng didn't program DKC4, TTA6, Aladdin (maybe), EWJ3 & MK4. And if you look at it the other way, if Silvers Lin was Hummer Cheng, why didn't he compose any original music - or even recycle any of his old music - for TTA6, where he's both programmer and producer?

MLX

 

And also that "The Legend" game. Why someone who would have have worked on the music still had the source code of SFIV ? It would make sense if it was a programmer but not someone who done the music. The Legend is mainly a source code update to the game.[/quote]
I think it was more likely a graphic artist or something that kept the source code (maybe all the team members just kept a copy of everything), and some inexperienced programmer made the updates. If an original programmer was still around when the 15 in 1 was made, they probably would have done a better job splitting Titenic etc.

MLX

 

Also you didn't answer my message about KoF96.[/quote]
well, I'm not sure about KOF, it's weird. but it looks to me like the "1998" thing in the ending and the removed JY graphics were last minute changes - if they'd had more time to do it, they probably would have removed the JY code entirely, and redrawn the title screen to say '98. It could have been finished in 1997, after SFZ2, but JY couldn't/wouldn't publish it and it was only picked up by NT in 1998.

MLX

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15in1 investigation

That "garbeling the JY logo" is something that companies does when they want to delete it. They usually cannot delete the button combinaison in the code but can remove it from the CHR. Which means KoF96 wasn't made for NT and probably released under JY but in very low quantities. And actually it takes way more time to remove graphics from the CHR than removong 2 to 5 lines of code...

Hummer Cheng stuff:
Maybe when you are the producer and the only one programmer, you don't have much time to make the musics. Especially when the engine need to be created.

Also eveb if it was another programmer, do you really think he would have found the things to change ? Only the original programmer of a game can fully understand what he wrote.

And they would forgot to remove it 2 times even if it's a different programmer for the second time? Yay ! Escpecially that debug is dangerous for the game (can freeze).

And the unexperienced programmer made quiet well update. Adding all the fixes SFIV needed... And what's next ? The programmer is experienced this time ?

And just a last question: Why Hummer Cheng wouldn't have programmed Harry's Legend and other ABAB stuff ?

taizou

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15in1 investigation

well if KOF96 was originally released by JY, it might have been in 1997, and NT only released their version in 1998. I guess we won't know for sure unless someone finds the JY version.

and okay maybe Harry's Legend was made by Cheng.  but I *really* don't think Cheng programmed ABAB's original games - Panda Adventure for example seems more like the sort of simple game a new programmer or even a student would make, rather than the guy who programmed Titenic and stuff.

as for The Legend, maybe it wasnt made by ABAB's programmer at all - someone must have kept SFIV's source for 11 years, so it could have been updated anytime between 1994 and 2005, and just never released (or released in small quantities).

MLX

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15in1 investigation

But then how it (The Legend) arrived in a 15in1 multicart with a bunch of ABAB Soft games?
And no, KoF96 was made in 1998. I'm pretty sure NT is lying on the label. There's a NT cart with a lower id which has 2000 year on it.

taizou

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15in1 investigation

The Legend probably got there the same way Titenic did - because the ex-Hummer member(s) at ABAB (the graphic artist or whoever) still had a copy.

& I still think we can't be sure about KOF until someone finds the actual original JY cart (if that exists).

[MLX]

That "garbeling the JY logo" is something that companies does when they want to delete it. They usually cannot delete the button combinaison in the code but can remove it from the CHR. Which means KoF96 wasn't made for NT and probably released under JY but in very low quantities. And actually it takes way more time to remove graphics from the CHR than removong 2 to 5 lines of code...

Hummer Cheng stuff:
Maybe when you are the producer and the only one programmer, you don't have much time to make the musics. Especially when the engine need to be created.

Also eveb if it was another programmer, do you really think he would have found the things to change ? Only the original programmer of a game can fully understand what he wrote.

And they would forgot to remove it 2 times even if it's a different programmer for the second time? Yay ! Escpecially that debug is dangerous for the game (can freeze).

And the unexperienced programmer made quiet well update. Adding all the fixes SFIV needed... And what's next ? The programmer is experienced this time ?

And just a last question: Why Hummer Cheng wouldn't have programmed Harry's Legend and other ABAB stuff ?

[taizou]

well if KOF96 was originally released by JY, it might have been in 1997, and NT only released their version in 1998. I guess we won't know for sure unless someone finds the JY version.

and okay maybe Harry's Legend was made by Cheng.  but I *really* don't think Cheng programmed ABAB's original games - Panda Adventure for example seems more like the sort of simple game a new programmer or even a student would make, rather than the guy who programmed Titenic and stuff.

as for The Legend, maybe it wasnt made by ABAB's programmer at all - someone must have kept SFIV's source for 11 years, so it could have been updated anytime between 1994 and 2005, and just never released (or released in small quantities).

[MLX]

But then how it (The Legend) arrived in a 15in1 multicart with a bunch of ABAB Soft games?
And no, KoF96 was made in 1998. I'm pretty sure NT is lying on the label. There's a NT cart with a lower id which has 2000 year on it.

[taizou]

The Legend probably got there the same way Titenic did - because the ex-Hummer member(s) at ABAB (the graphic artist or whoever) still had a copy.

& I still think we can't be sure about KOF until someone finds the actual original JY cart (if that exists).